Maybe you should make a little web game, a quiz with some tricky questions to teach people all the terminology: Free (as in beer), Open Source, Free and Open Source, Open Source (but not Free as in Speech), etc. Something fun and funny like the JsDate quiz: https://jsdate.wtf/ (I hope you can run that. The code is MIT: samwho/jsdate.wtf is the github repo).

Would seriously be helpful.

Cringe and proprietary pilled.

Do you work in the software industry? I have a feeling you don't because you literally can't if you hold to your free software extremist views. For all us normies out there who make daily compromises (and I feel like I make fewer compromises than most, the LLM stuff isn't going away.

I was inherently skeptical of a lot of it too, because most of the weighted random token guessing machines are mostly wrong or annoying. The fact is, it has gotten better though. Early stuff could only regurgitate solved problems. When trying to develop an RTSP server in Kotlin/Java, I remember one of these tools, after several prompts/iterations, simply give me a skeleton and "Add your RTSP implementation here." It could not do anything novel. At my last job before layoffs, we had a CoPilot license and the code it generated wasn't great and had a lot of issues.

Recently using the IntelliJ $10 plan, I was trying to adapt my MediaHug app (AGPLv3) to work on Wayland. To do that, I needed to use the existing python-mpv library to render to OpenGL in Qt6. There were examples out there, but only for QQuick and my application uses traditional QWidgets. There were literally no examples I could find anywhere, and I looked at a LOT of QtOpenGLWidget examples. My forum question went unanswered. The generated example I got from the IntelliJ chat wasn't perfect, but it did work and I eventually massaged it into this implementation:

https://gitlab.com/djsumdog/mediahug/-/blob/master/mediahug/gui/mpv/gl_player.py?ref_type=heads

This is a novel implementation that doesn't exist in any off the official python-mpv documentation or any other examples I could find.

Do NOT use LLMs to copy software

The trouble is, that's probably not what LLMs do. A lot of people quote Carmack's fast inverse square root example of the early CoPilot while it was in beta (where it duplicated his code including comments). I suspect at this time Microsoft was probably still using a lot of Vector Search combined with RAG. I don't think a lot of model tools like Claude/GPT4 do that anymore for liability reasons (and all the enterprise licenses contain clauses where they'll accept liability for lawsuits. I really want to see one of these go to court). The models themselves cannot store actual code. They're massive weight/parameter mappings. That's why so much of it seems "made up." But at the same time, we can't really know what the big commercial models are doing behind the scenes. I doubt they're straight copying from RAG or Vector search anymore though.

The trouble in industry is we're facing massive layoffs. The AI stuff has massive speedup advantages, and it's getting weirdly better in some respects. I know several people who've told me they wouldn't hire any senior engineers who refuse to use it. There's no really turning back the clock on this stuff now, if you want to get/stay employed.

@djsumdog @xianc78 >Something fun and funny like the JsDate quiz: https://jsdate.wtf/ (I hope you can run that. The code is MIT: samwho/jsdate.wtf is the github repo).
I refuse to run that, as arbitrary JavaScript execution is always proprietary software no matter the license, as I don't have control over the software.

>Maybe you should make a little web game, a quiz with some tricky questions to teach people all the terminology: Free (as in beer), Open Source, Free and Open Source, Open Source (but not Free as in Speech), etc.
I'd rather compose a total proprietary death presentation really.

>Do you work in the software industry?
No - I don't write proprietary malware.

>The generated example I got from the IntelliJ chat wasn't perfect, but it did work and I eventually massaged it into this implementation:
You won the gamble this time, but looks like slop.

>links to gitlab.

># License: AGPLv3
Is it AGPLv3-only, or AGPLv3-or-later?

(Although if a substantial amount was copied via a LLM, you are clearly not the copyright holder).

>The trouble is, that's probably not what LLMs do.
So tell me, where do LLM's get the software from? It doesn't come out of thin air does it?

>I suspect at this time Microsoft was probably still using a lot of Vector Search combined with RAG.
microsoft appears to have adjusted co-pilot to check the outputs against the entirety of github and discard outputs that were direct copies - combinations (which LLMs do) seem to get past such filter.

>The models themselves cannot store actual code. They're massive weight/parameter mappings.
Such weight/parameter mappings appears to work out as an undocumented form of lossy compression where the code is stored.

>I know several people who've told me they wouldn't hire any senior engineers who refuse to use it. There's no really turning back the clock on this stuff now, if you want to get/stay employed.
The NEET will inherent the Earth.

If you want to churn out slop fast, yes a LLM will be great - but good luck if you want reliable software that isn't full of bugs (for example, I've seen an LLM output that instructed to check for overflow with an if check (which gcc will optimize out), rather than the GCC overflow builtin (the actual fix)).

You won the gamble this time, but looks like slop.

The only generated parts where the OpenGL/MpvRender context handling and I've heavily modified it/rewritten it. So that's my code you're calling slop asshole.

links to gitlab.

Where do you hose your free and non-proprietary code? You have anything up and published anywhere? or do you just complain a lot without writing any software?

Such weight/parameter mappings appears to work out as an undocumented form of lossy compression where the code is stored.

There's a whole field of research dedicated to how information or facts are stored in neural networks. "lossy compression" isn't a good analogy. Token relations are stored in a very high dimensional space. 3Blue1Brown does some great explanations of this. Not sure if using yt-dlp goes against your ethos:

https://youtu.be/9-Jl0dxWQs8

I refuse to run that, as arbitrary JavaScript execution is always proprietary software no matter the license, as I don't have control over the software.

Do you drive a car? Was it made after the 1970s? Does it have an ECM? Did you rewrite the software on the ECM? Maybe you only take trains. Is the software for the ticketing system or for the signal controls non-proprietary? Maybe you just bicycle. Did you make sure the CAD software used by all the component designers was non-proprietary? Have you ever flown on an airplane?

At this point, I can't see you as anything other than a troll. There's no way you could be this way in real life. You're obviously using the Internet and not a hermit in the woods. You're literally using dozens if not hundreds or proprietary routers and hardware to get and receive messages on the fediverse instance you use.

@djsumdog @Suiseiseki
>You're literally using dozens if not hundreds or proprietary routers and hardware to get and receive messages on the fediverse instance you use.

Stallman has openly said that networked services don't count as software and that nonfree software on routers, servers, and switches only affects the people running said devices.

https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/network-services-arent-free-or-nonfree.html

@xianc78 @djsumdog In the article, he is pointing out facts, rather than saying something.

@djsumdog @xianc78 >So that's my code you're calling slop asshole.
I was clearly not attempting to attack you personally for sloppy looking code - but you attack me?

I've had someone point out that some of my code was bad and I could admit that it was bad without getting all uppity.

>Where do you hose your free and non-proprietary code?
With free git hosting software - there are many options to choose from that don't attack the user with proprietary JavaScript.

>There's a whole field of research dedicated to how information or facts are stored in neural networks.
A whole field of reverse engineering is required to work out how information is stored?

Sounds absolutely proprietary to me.

>Do you drive a car? Was it made after the 1970s? Does it have an ECM? Did you rewrite the software on the ECM?
Well there it is - those furthest from freedom always demand the highest level of perfection.

I will not drive a car with remote proprietary software updates, as I'm not big on being driven to a torture prison.

I will not buy a car that requires agreeing to a proprietary license or one that contains a mobile chipset.

When it comes to embedded devices like ECU's and microwaves etc, it sucks that the hardware is proprietary and that technically those also run software - but in the case where it is not demanded that the user agrees to a proprietary license and no updates are offered - there is little difference between proprietary circuits and proprietary embedded software - as either won't ever be changed and the user actually owns the hardware and can do whatever they want with it.

I'd rather prefer to be driving GNU/Car with 100% free software and a free hardware design, but I'm not yet ready to start on that project.

>Maybe you only take trains. Is the software for the ticketing system or for the signal controls non-proprietary
The ticketing software isn't being run on my computer - it's being run on the train service provider.

Provided that it is possible to get a train ticket anonymously, the ticketing software being proprietary is the service providers loss and not yours.

>Did you make sure the CAD software used by all the component designers was non-proprietary?
Yes, component designers should only use free CAD software for their own freedom sake - but that's nothing to do with me.

>Have you ever flown on an airplane?
That's a transport service.

I avoid aeroplane travel now as the proprietary control software has now become deadly (previously it didn't nosedive the plane into the ground).

>There's no way you could be this way in real life.
I refuse to run proprietary software on my holy computers in this real life - but there's obviously not much I can do about proprietary software on other people's computers.

>You're obviously using the Internet and not a hermit in the woods.
I would love to be in GNU/Cave - a nice long fibre connection would work fine really.

>You're literally using dozens if not hundreds or proprietary routers and hardware to get and receive messages on the fediverse instance you use.
My router is GNUbooted and runs 100% free software.

Yes, the packets do get routed by other people's computers that are full of spyware and malware, which is why encryption and tor is necessary.

@Suiseiseki @djsumdog @xianc78
> Such weight/parameter mappings appears to work out as an undocumented form of lossy compression where the code is stored.

interesting perspective!

> The NEET will inherent the Earth.

indeed. what's the point in doing work that sucks the life out of you and then have at least half the money stolen to be used against you.

the expectation is that one has to use LLM to even be considered feels like a giant brainwashing op tbh. requiring people to use a statistical black box, created using a secret process and stolen data, requiring unobtainium hardware to run effectively.