@alyx @critical Go back to giving it a serious go and see how it goes.

@Eris @critical
With you? I'd rather have a discussion with your foot at this point.

@alyx @critical Why are you still here then

@alyx @critical Also, why are you suddenly so aggressive?

@Eris @critical
Both of you basically called me a murderer, and I'm the aggressive one.

@alyx >Both of you basically called me a murderer, and I’m the aggressive one.

So you’ve had an abortion?

@Eris @critical

@NEETzsche @critical @Eris
Is fapping and cumming in a tissue the same as an abortion? Checking your definitions on everything now... who knows what the hell people will come up with next.

@alyx @NEETzsche @critical
>Is fapping and cumming in a tissue the same as an abortion?
No, of course not.

@alyx @NEETzsche @critical

A sperm cell is human, but which human is it? If you kill the sperm cell, does that human die?
A fetus is human, but which human is it? If you kill the fetus, does that human die?

@Eris @NEETzsche @alyx @critical
Life begins at conception (the Church's teaching) is the most logically coherent. You either believe that or you are basically ok with infanticide. No one can ever explain exactly when life begins, because any other answer like "At birth" or "when a heartbeat is detected" is so variable it becomes absurd.

@Samhydeigger @critical @NEETzsche @Eris
The only reason that works for Christians is because they add in the concept of the soul at the same time. It's not just the "life" part that is important for them, it's that the life has a soul that is critical. Of course this brings in a lot more theological problems that Christians are usually unaware of, like how do twins' souls work, or do the countless miscarried pregnancies also have souls?
And not to mention that this goes out the window when you're talking with either a non-believer, or someone who's religion is far too different than mainstream Christianity.

@alyx @critical @NEETzsche @Eris Ok from a scientific point of view only, when does life begin? I need the exact moment btw.

@Samhydeigger @critical @NEETzsche @Eris
Life begins with each and every cell division.

@alyx @Samhydeigger @critical @NEETzsche

Which life, specifically?

@Eris @critical @NEETzsche @Samhydeigger
That's something I need to ask you. Or rather Samhydeigger I guess, but you can answer too.

@alyx @Eris @critical @NEETzsche A human life begins at conception. When does it begin to you?

@Samhydeigger @critical @NEETzsche @Eris
What do you mean by "a human life"? Do you mean the life of something with human DNA? The life of a person that is human? Or something else.

@alyx @Samhydeigger @critical @NEETzsche @Eris you didn't ask me but I'll answer.

A human life is one that has genetic code working autonomously. Meaning that there is DNA, as imperfect as it may be, that is 100% home sapien, functioning on it's own. So this includes the moment an egg is fertilized, identical twins, people who are brain dead, really retarded and downy humanoid creatures, theoretical freezing, etc.

It wouldn't cover some forms of siamese twins as 2 separated humans, like the ones that completely share a system and contain identical DNA that work in tandem. Obviously it wouldn't cover a dead person, or a theoretical hybrid or human DNA inserted in like mice to make ears or whatever.

It's really a simple answer if you take away "human" and add another living thing like "cat" or "horse". Would you consider a retarded horse a horse? Would you consider a fetal horse a horse? Does it become a cat when it's a fetus? What if there's 2? Etc.

@Tepid_Tapir @alyx @Eris @NEETzsche @Samhydeigger so a fetus is a human being and a person, just like an adult. So aborting it would be murder. If it wanted to be dead it would kill itself, just like an adult would, right?

@critical @NEETzsche @Eris @Samhydeigger @Tepid_Tapir
In my view there is a period of time when a fetus can be called human and yet not a person.

@alyx @critical @NEETzsche @Samhydeigger @Tepid_Tapir

>In my view there is a period of time when a fetus can be called human and yet not a person.
Are you going to make any effort at all to make that view coherent to anyone other than yourself?
That's what this thread is, remember?

@Eris @critical @NEETzsche @Samhydeigger @Tepid_Tapir
I'll give you a hint, and let you think it out yourself: what changes between a human being 100% healthy, alive, whatever, and the very same human being brain dead.

@alyx @critical @NEETzsche @Samhydeigger @Tepid_Tapir Your only goal for this thread was to prove that you can clearly explicate a coherent point.
It was the lowest bar possible and you couldn't even pass it.

@Eris @critical @NEETzsche @Samhydeigger @Tepid_Tapir
Please don't state what my goals were for me. You're not a mind reader. You tried it a few times already, and failed miserably each and every time.

@alyx @critical @NEETzsche @Samhydeigger @Tepid_Tapir

>Please don't state what my goals were for me.
It's my thread. The goal is the goal. If you don't want to play the game go away.

@Eris @critical @NEETzsche @Samhydeigger @Tepid_Tapir
Your goal is your goal, my goal is mine. They can be very different things.

@alyx @critical @NEETzsche @Samhydeigger @Tepid_Tapir

It's a game with pre-defined goals. Either you want to play or you don't. I did not invite you to do whatever gay shit you are doing. Either play or go.

@Eris @critical @NEETzsche @Samhydeigger @Tepid_Tapir
Your predefined goals. I can still have my separate goal.
If I want to play soccer with the goal to try touching the ball with my hand as many times as possible, I can do that and completely ignore the predefined goals of the game of soccer.

@alyx @critical @NEETzsche @Samhydeigger @Tepid_Tapir If everyone else is playing soccer and you start playing football you are a dickhead.

@Eris @alyx @NEETzsche @Samhydeigger @Tepid_Tapir and here we even have the different definition of football.

@critical @NEETzsche @Eris @Samhydeigger @Tepid_Tapir
I just went with soccer precisely to avoid that problem. I guess I could have gone with basketball instead, but I like that sport even less.

@alyx @critical @NEETzsche @Samhydeigger @Tepid_Tapir You were invited to do something, either do it or go away.

@Eris @critical @NEETzsche @Samhydeigger @Tepid_Tapir
And what if I don't?

@alyx @critical @NEETzsche @Samhydeigger @Tepid_Tapir Then you will kill what could have been a good thread.
Oh look, that's what happened.

@Eris @alyx @NEETzsche @Samhydeigger @Tepid_Tapir a discussion is when you have an open mind and willingness to consider different opinions. Otherwise it's a monolog

@critical @NEETzsche @Samhydeigger @Tepid_Tapir @alyx

I am willing to consider different opinions. You're unwilling to give them to me.

@Eris @critical @NEETzsche @Samhydeigger @Tepid_Tapir
I gave you my opinion that "human" and "person" are two different things. You refused it.

@alyx @critical @NEETzsche @Samhydeigger @Tepid_Tapir You just said it. You don't say how they are different or why, and when I don't agree with you, you say "WELP CONVERSATION OVER" but then still reply for literally hours for nor eason, occasionally starting to argue again before dipping back into weird meta-discussion of how you can't discuss it.

Stop behaving like a fag dude holy shit.