hot takes that shouldn't be hot takes gauntlet:

informed consent is unnecessary for most sexual interaction.

if it can in some way, shape or form indicate dislike it can consent.

statutory rape doesn't exist.

most child trauma resulting from non violent sexual interaction is caused by sociopsychological external influences and not the sexual interaction itself.

"violence can never be the answer" is a sign of privilege, ignorance or stockholm syndrome.

rape can and has had positive outcomes for people and silencing those who talk about it because it doesn't fit your victim narrative makes you an exclusionary asshole.

@Lucyfr
>rape can and has had positive outcomes for people and silencing those who talk about it because it doesn't fit your victim narrative makes you an exclusionary asshole.

what?

@grumpy ?

@Lucyfr im asking you to elaborate

how can rape be positive? what is your point exactly?

@grumpy kinda hard to explain as someone who hasn't gone through it but I've talked with survivors who shared their experiences with me. for some it's a kink for others they were raped by someone they loved and enjoyed it. also the same concept as forcing the victim label on to every child that has sex with an adult applies here as well. lots of trauma coming from how their surroundings react and how hard they push them into this role.

@Lucyfr @grumpy Definitionally, if someone enjoys an experience, whether or not consent was granted, it's not rape. That's why Statutory Rape is not a thing, essentially the "victims" "owners" did not consent to having their "property" fucked, so it's "rape". Statutory Rape devalues and dehumanizes the very human beings it is intended to protect. To call these experiences "positive rapes" is improper, because they are not definitionally rape. The language around rape has become so muddied that it's very difficult to pick apart what people actually mean when they're talking about it.

@Jazzy_Butts @grumpy

> Definitionally, if someone enjoys an experience, whether or not consent was granted, it's not rape.

no. by definition only consent matters regardless of if you've enjoyed the experience or not. I have actually no clue where you got that from.

the rest of that is based on that false premise so I'm cba adressing every point individually and will instead say this: rape is sex that you were coerced to have. you could argue that if you enjoy something you're automatically consenting to it but since we are animals that get addicted to shit pretty quickly it would, by your definition, open the conversation to forced morphine injections since the high is most definitely enjoyable. just because we may or may not enjoy something doesn't make it consensual/non consensual. you are btw indirectly confirming the aforementioned sociological connotation by assuming that rape is this super horrible thing nobody could ever enjoy. think about antis talking about how kids can't consent and that having sex with them can only ever be harmful, you're doing the exact same thing although in a different context which needs a lot more nuance.

@Lucyfr @grumpy We define rape differently. If someone jams a cupcake in my mouth and I did not enjoy it, I was violated, if someone jammed a cupcake in my mouth and I loved it, we were playing. Cut and dry imo.

@Jazzy_Butts @grumpy yeah your definition is not conforming to how most people understand rape and consent. you take a hedonistic stance which, as I mentioned, brings it's own nuance that I'm not trying to address.

@Lucyfr @grumpy If I give my girlfriend a rose with the intent of pleasing her so she would be more likely to want to please me, did I coerce her?

@Jazzy_Butts @grumpy are you forcing her to accept the rose?

@Lucyfr @grumpy No, but it could be viewed as manipulation, which is a form of coercion imo