menu bars belong global at the top of the screen.

@icedquinn you mean, like this?

@pasture @icedquinn
So like Gnome3 tried to do it. From my experience, that becomes a pain in the but fast. Seems nice at first, but it's horrible when you have multiple smaller windows, and need to work with the menu in each of them. There's a lot more mouse movement and clicks suddenly taking place.

@alyx @pasture true but contemplate why is there a separate menu in each window.

the global menu at top is objectively superior and has been proven so scientifically. it has an infinitely low navigation distance (all 4 corners of the screen do, because slamming the mouse gets you there with no nimbleness), takes up less space, and the user always knows where it is.

if you see well designed mac software (and well, the amiga did it too) it’s not really a problem. it’s only a problem when you try to hack it like that one gtk patch but people still design the UI like donkeys.

@icedquinn @pasture
There's so much wrong there.

No, the navigation distance isn't low. The lowest navigation distance to the menu is gonna be lowest when it's in the window, cause you're most likely already working with said window.
Not to mention that if you are switching from window A to window B, you need to first click window B and then go up to the global menu to access the menu for window B. In normal local menu style, I just go with the mouse over window B and click it's menu directly.

>well designed mac software
Nothing in a mac is well designed. Stop believing the lies. Macs can literally have fans that are not even close to the heatsinks they're supposed to cool down.

@alyx @pasture navigation difficulty, sorry.

@icedquinn @pasture
You're still wrong.

@alyx @pasture i’m literally not.

Placing layout elements on the four edges of the screen allows for infinitely large targets in one dimension and therefore present ideal scenarios. As the user’s pointer will always stop at the edge, they can move the mouse with the greatest possible speed and still hit the target. The target area is effectively infinitely long along the movement axis. Therefore, this guideline is called “Rule of the infinite edges”. The use of this rule can be seen for example in MacOS, which places the menu bar always on the top left edge of the screen instead of the current programs windowframe.[28]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fitts%27s_law

@icedquinn @pasture
It works for Photoshop, Gimp, Blender, Premiere etc. As in, it works for when it's a single program you're using, and placing panels on the edges.

It doesn't work when you're dealing with multiple programs, and have to switch between them and use another program's menu.
I've tried it, and am speaking from experience. You'd think it's better, but it's not. The only reason it "works" for MacOS, is because it's a piece of shit software, running on a piece of shit hardware, that was designed for low brained users, that barely use 1 program at a time.

Real life doesn't work like some stupid textbook. This is a common problem with UI design. Things that the math says should work, don't actually work, because humans aren't robots. If UI design actually worked like in a textbook, you'd be typing with a dvorak keyboard right now, and you're not.

@alyx @icedquinn @pasture
>The only reason it "works" for MacOS, is because it's a piece of shit software, running on a piece of shit hardware, that was designed for low brained users, that barely use 1 program at a time.

is that why Macs are mostly used by Musicians and Graphic Designers ?

@TheMadPirate @alyx @pasture used to be because those people had the money to pay apple tax and didn't want to deal with IT bullshit.

although apple has utterly failed to keep up with the pro hardware which has kinda fucked them.

@icedquinn @TheMadPirate @alyx @pasture have they?

@fluffy they left the mac pro lines get grossly outdated compared to the market because and then they tossed out an iMac Pro but then they recently fucked that again by going nah man we use some proprietary ARM chip now and we don't care about the iMac Pro now buy your new manilla folder chromebook that will struggle to emulate your video compression code.

@TheMadPirate @alyx @pasture

@icedquinn @fluffy @TheMadPirate @alyx are you trying to tell me macbooks aren’t incredibly based? I’ll have you know…