@rick @keisuke You talking about Bocchi the Rock

@stefan @keisuke mh? yeah?

@rick @keisuke Just watched it really recently (like last week) And atleast from what I can see from the talk (which is only your post before my answer) there is truth to what you say.

Bocchi herself has a clear goal in mind but she needs to get terms with her anxiety though to get even a chance to reach it though. So she is forced (kind of) to be a better version of herself. With maybe some outside help but the final push in the direction is coming from her.

Also the slow improvement (which is steadily visiable throughout the show) made her pretty believeable as a character to me. She might be an extreme case of an introvert but even still...

As for outside-forces. You always need some form of outside to help you realize you have a problem and gain the desire to change it. For me it was a friend telling me I should get my ass of the ground and do *something* to not feel lonely anymore. Which I try to do bit by bit.

That said I am still working on my skills with people and mess up again and again along the way (really depends on the person I interact with though some are more lenient to me than others)

But I also see that too much outside pressure might lead to more going back into ones shell really.

Its a delicate balance for me also to kinda feel well interacting in a group of people.

Though the anime gives me yet another push (after that one week in college talking about stuff on the psychological side and how to maybe approach opening up more)

@stefan @keisuke >Also the slow improvement (which is steadily visiable throughout the show) made her pretty believeable as a character to me. She might be an extreme case of an introvert but even still...

yeah, this what i loved so much about the show.. you clearly see a small and steady progress.. i also see some parallels to my past self, but i was never thaaaaaatttt bad back than. i always had some friends, but i had problems speaking to stranges (maybe a little bit like in watamote)

>As for outside-forces. You always need some form of outside to help you realize you have a problem and gain the desire to change it

okay, yeah you and @keisuke are right. if my friends never said 'hey, wanna go to that dev meetup' i would probably never changed much.. there i saw that even strange ppl can become good friends. also strangers don't kill you if you talk to them ;) after that i did go to more meetups.. still have some goosebumps somtimes, but its mostly these meetups are still fun

also here my favorite scene: https://super8.absturztau.be/watch?v=QjmnsAWGm8E

@rick @keisuke The anime is generally praised for it nice visuals (some shots were just wild! ) But yeah it does give me as an introvert myself just a "I see you there!" Which feels nice. As I said she is relatable. But the magic I think really is that you don't need to be an introvert yourself to understand bocchi.

Also she is way less "scary" than other portrayals of introverts like maybe komi-san which comes across as intimidating I have seen.

The anime really struck a cord with me since I am kinda on a journey of self-improvement myself right now. Hope it goes somewhat. (And I actually survive going to that spring festival my flatmate invited me to go to on saturday... I will give it my best. @.@

@stefan @rick Bocchi really struck a chord in me because i really was somethin like that... i really AM something like that, and yeah everything despite being very hopeful and lighthearted, i totally understand 100% what bocchi thinks, i identified a bit too with Kuroki Tomoko albeit i wasn't as cringe as her... i think!

The problem of being like this is that you can't really help yourself sink more and more because of the spiral of self destructive feedback that is your mind. Some people jumps out of it on their own and that comendable but a lot of times you really need external help, espceially if you didn't realy had good cemented friendships during that period.

I give that Bocchi at least had the courage to change and stir things up a bit, which made her bump into Nijika which got her out of that rut, but not everyone else has that, i'm afraid.

@rick well, talking to her instead of just staring and pretending nothing bad happens would be a good start.

If i were to have a kid with such problems i would try to help in any meaninful way, of course not by forcing random friends into her life, but mostly trying to put her in situations where it's easier for her to make friends, maybe putting her into some kind of club or fun extra-curricular activities would help... see what interests her and try to make her get together with people that may share her interests, idk.

Sometimes random events like bumping into random strangers help, but not always and they are rare events, and the pasivity of the parents really troubles me.

@keisuke @keisuke @rick
Parents can definitely be a problem when they insert themselves into developing relationships, my parents did this multiple times. Bocchi's a great example of a issue that a lot of socially inept people face; they cannot initiate. They lack the skills to start relationships or lead conversations. In the show that doesn't happen, but basically the best case scenario for such a person happens, someone else pressures them into a social group that they already wanted to be in. A club definitely seems like a good way to try and get around this, as it's much easier to start talking to people when you know everybody shares an interest, whatever the club is about serves as a perfect pre-set conversation topic.. Though a child might resist joining a club if they have social anxiety.

@Reluctant_Weeb @rick i think good part of the difficulty that people like that (like me) has to initiate relationships is the lack of self esteem, and the lack of self esteem stems from the lack of perceived accomplishments. Despite her being good at the guitar, she has problems with that because i think she didn't had a proper route or path of milestones to gauge her progress.