@icedquinn @bronze Democracy is unnatural, at least.

@xianc78 @bronze typically speaking nicer forms of governance just get conquered by the brutal ones.

@icedquinn @xianc78 @bronze
Incorrect.
Nicer forms of governance get conquered by the more powerful ones.
Power comes from resources. Stored energy.

@mystik @bronze @xianc78 given a state that is honorable and a state that is run by total sociopaths, the total sociopaths will learn you can just threaten the kids all the time and get what you want.

partly why the concept of war ethics is stupid

@icedquinn @xianc78 @bronze
Being nice doesn't mean being ineffective at war.

@mystik @bronze @xianc78 it tends to. how many countries are around today that *never* resorted to combat slavery (conscription)?

@icedquinn @xianc78 @bronze
"Never", idk, I'm not an historian, but I'm pretty sure there are many.

@icedquinn @xianc78 @bronze
Resources, as always. Resources are the key to everything.

@mystik @icedquinn @bronze @xianc78
the world cannot grow more resources if there are too many people taking from it

@Dave @bronze @icedquinn @xianc78
There can't be "too many people" for the next centuries, for the next millennium even.
There's just too much space in this world, it's too big.

What we need is better technology to produce those resources. Either we do it in a centralized way (empowering even more already existing evil entities), or in a decentralized way (empowering individuals and small communities).

@mystik @bronze @icedquinn @xianc78
>space
is not the limiting resource

@Dave @bronze @icedquinn @xianc78
Correct. According to current mainstream paradigms there are a lot of limiting factors. They all can be reduced to energy production/storage.

@mystik @bronze @icedquinn @xianc78
how about food supply energy like fertilizer

@Dave @bronze @icedquinn @xianc78 It all comes from energy. Once you have sufficient energy you can turn ANYTHING into a paradise.

@mystik @bronze @icedquinn @xianc78
guess that explains why Israel and north Africa is a deserted shithole - they don't terraform

@Dave @bronze @icedquinn @xianc78
China does.
This is Jordan:
https://noagendatube.com/w/pbPnyZFmQX4spYCBgmjAno

@mystik @bronze @icedquinn @xianc78
yes, just goes to show by "ENERGY" you also mean human work - energy making the situation better not worse. constantly.

@Dave @bronze @icedquinn @xianc78
Once it's built, it's built. It requires an initial investment, yes.

@mystik @bronze @icedquinn @xianc78
disagree, landscaping, terraforming, composting is the price humans have to pay for having large cities. its a constant job.

@Dave @bronze @icedquinn @xianc78
We're mixing two things here.
One thing is terraforming, what this "Greening The Desert" project does.
Another thing is food production. For that there are solutions that, again, involve lots of energy too.
https://piped.kavin.rocks/watch?v=AGcYApKfHuY

@mystik @bronze @icedquinn @xianc78
both go hand in hand, the best food is grown in a more natural environment without pests and insecticides, mass produced food requires unnatural conditions like deforestation which is the antithesis to terraforming.

@Dave @bronze @icedquinn @xianc78
Natural is what gives life. What plants want. You can emulate that.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGcYApKfHuY

@mystik @bronze @icedquinn @xianc78
right by not cutting down all of the trees to start a sorghum farm

@mystik @bronze @icedquinn @xianc78
>natural is better
>posts a picture from inside a mass-production facility
are you daft

@Dave @bronze @icedquinn @xianc78 lol
lol
I get you man. I mean there are less limitations than you think. There are always solutions when you got the resources to make them real. That's my point.

@mystik @bronze @icedquinn @xianc78
I imagine a world where NOBODY needs mass produced food and can live off the nearby ecosystems sustainably.

@xianc78 @Dave @icedquinn @xianc78 @bronze @mystik

>Fertilizer
I am not quite sure all the things you guys are talking about but I saw the word fertilizer and felt the urge to insert the following:
they don't use fertilizer where I live. Only leftovers and water. Now, for some reason, these people fill the gallons and leave them for days before using. I have yet to ask why.
That said, I have yet to see land as healthy as this one. You see lots of earthworms everywhere, and as you may or may not know, nothing in this world is better for plants as their waste.

Sorry for the interruption.

@ishadowx @icedquinn @xianc78 @bronze @Dave
>"don't know what you guys talking 'bout"
>poastard
Checks out. Tell Graf to unban me.

@ishadowx @icedquinn @xianc78 @bronze @mystik
mass produced food requires
deforestation
chemical fertilizer
chemical pesticides
etc.

quality food grows in a natural environment

@Dave @icedquinn @xianc78 @bronze @mystik oh! I forgot one tiny but very important detail:

There are river pathways, both natural and man-made, all over the place in this prefecture. Not sure if it is the same elsewhere, but I suppose that also helps the plants a lot. Anyway, with regards to the mass producing requirements, we need to just send all the imbeciles back to their jungles. If don’t want to work, you should not eat.

@ishadowx @icedquinn @xianc78 @bronze @mystik
we have 'rivers' too but we call them canals and they bring polluted water into our estuaries where i used to like to fish. but is now full of run off from sugar cane plantations

@Dave @ishadowx @bronze @icedquinn @xianc78 Man, that's criminal.

@mystik @bronze @icedquinn @ishadowx @xianc78
>crystal clear water inshore
>hurricane comes
>they dump water from Lake Okeechobee
>water turns dark brown and floating dead fresh water fish in salt water

@bronze Yes. He used to work with James Rolfe on various Cinemassacre projects, but now he does his own streams.