@ChristiJunior Telling Trump he can’t talk down to him (I’m not here to play cards) was absolutely childish.
>cuck to the US because we gave you money
would you have preferred he grovelled on his knees? at least he has some self-respect, unlike trump himself who wont even say a negative word towards Putin and kisses elon's feet.
enjoy oligarchy, trial ran in Russia and coming to America.
No country holds elections during war time.
>inb4 1944 America
the war wasn't on US soil.
>I'd rather Zelensky fund his own damn war
with what money? Ukraine is not rich. America funds tons and tons of wars. yet you draw the line at Ukraine?
Do you believe we should leave our allies to the wolves?
@yomiel @griffith @ChristiJunior the united states should not fund wars. if there is a war that we believe we should get involved in, it better be boots on the ground for an imminent threat. not this proxy war bullshit that only gets other nations destroyed when things might be very different if america didn't shove their cock into every orifice the world has to offer.
It seems weird that the first war you wish the United States to stop funding is Ukraine. Why now is there so much political will to stop funding foreign wars from the US government? Do you not in the slightest find that odd?
@yomiel @griffith @ChristiJunior oh i forgot you know literally everything about me my bad!
i've had this position forever. it is probably my most consistent belief throughout my life. i've always been anti-war. anti funding it, anti participating it. only if there is war on our soil should we engage, and there is a war on our soil right now in the form of illegal aliens, elite corruption, drug smuggling, and child trafficking. that's where our focus should be, not on israel or ukraine. i never liked us being in the middle east. thinking back to other wars i wasn't alive for, i disagree with the USA's involvement. i have always had the mindset that the US has an absurd amount of problems as-is that we need to focus on but instead we shit all that money away on the stupidest shit that doesn't even apply to us.
i think antagonizing countries that we have strenuous relationships with and that the world does in general is a really bad idea. it is much better to practice diplomacy and i genuinely think trump's conversations with putin and kim jong un are extremely productive not just for the US but for the world.
I didn't ask what you believe personally, I asked why now has the entire American political apparatus, including originally pro-war neocons, fallen behind the agenda of removing Ukraine's funding. People who wouldn't even dare speak on funding of Israel, or any other of the MIC's projects.
@yomiel @griffith @ChristiJunior i don't think there is some grand conspiracy to like let russia completely take over ukraine or something. i think trump actually just wants them to stop fighting and he's trying to get them to make a deal, but zelensky is not good at making deals.
a lot of the pro-war neocons are probably just trump dick suckers so they're like agreeing with whatever trump says. that would be my guess.
@yomiel @griffith @ChristiJunior this is how I see it:
It's like in boxing, the ref will call a match if one of the guys is too fucked up to continue, even if he wants to keep going. If he keeps going, it's not going to be pretty. Trump is trying to be that ref here and get between Putin and Zelensky, but Zelensky doesn't understand what's happening at all. He's going to get back in that ring, the ref will wash his hands of it, and Putin will beat him into a bloody pulp. It's not worth it. It really is not worth it. Having a fighting spirit is one thing, but when it devolves into being retarded you need someone to stop you.
My point is why is Trump not telling Putin to back off? Why must only Zelensky compromise in this situation. The US has many 'cards' to play, like lifting Russian sanctions, same with Europe.
I don't think Zelensky was ever planning to sign the mineral deal, which is why he made such a spectacle in the white house.
The question is why is Zelensky being made the bad guy when he wasn't the aggressor? You keep saying 'Zelensky is letting white people die' yet Putin could call off the war anytime.
Trump's actions suggest that he too envisions for a peace agreement somewhere along these lines.
Putin's tears are meaningless when he's willingly cut off Russia from the world. He'd still be in the G8 if not for his invasion of Crimea. He may have even gotten to join NATO one day.
I'm not pretending the west didn't fuck over Russia many times, especially in the collapse of the soviet union.
But it seems Putin has done barely anything to stop those same oligarchs created after the soviet collapse. I would support Putin if he cared about the Russian people, but he doesn't. For the same reason, I wouldn't want him controlling any of Ukraine.
Also, WTF are you talking about? Putin is famous for absolutely humiliating the oligarchs, either they bent the knee, or they ended up in jail. And yeah, no shit Putin is corrupt, but everything I've read about him suggests that he also genuinely wants for Russia to be strong and respected/feared. In the grand scheme of things, corruption is a relatively minor crime, especially compared to something like literally Replacing your people with hostile Invaders, which most Western leaders have been doing for many decades.
The mayor of Yelabuga, Rustem Nuriyev, delighted the city's residents with the news of the imminent arrival of another 24 thousand migrants.
At the same time, in a city with a population of 73 thousand residents, 10 thousand immigrants have already been registered, that is, the total number of foreign workers will make up almost half of the city. To provide them with housing, the mayor promised to build a huge microdistrict for 50 thousand residents. Despite the import of a huge number of strangers, half of the buses in the city are idle, and the industrial park is only 31% full. Together with the migrants, their families arrive, which leads to an increase in crime statistics - last year, juvenile crime increased by 12%. It is scary to even imagine what will happen after the arrival of another 24 thousand masturbators.
Putin is still beholden to oligarchs. If he wanted, he could have those oligarchs dead tomorrow. So why hasn't he? In reality he is still a bitch to his masters.
Barely anything is nationalized in Russia.
If he's not in charge of them, that's embarrassing. If he is in charge of them, he should've done more by now.
Oligarch != oligarchy. Oligarchy is the rule of the rich.
Ukraine is the victim of russian aggression and subversion that is actually fighting back in spite of that. That is what is missing in Americanized WN if one is being honest.
@andreas @griffith @ChristiJunior @yomiel then let them fight idgaf anymore just keep my money out of it
@andreas @griffith @ChristiJunior @yomiel oooohhh yeeeeesssss we are GETTING money from ukraine! yessssss keep the war going then, i love getting more money in exchange for lives being lost in a foreign country! yeeesssss!!! 
Pick one. Either you are losing money or your gaining money. You definitely do not care for the loss of life. I can tell you that.
@andreas @griffith @ChristiJunior @yomiel i don't give a fuck what my nation thinks i give a fuck what i think
Yes, of course. People like Marco Rubio are falling in line to Trump because that's what they do. I don't think people like that are getting handed brief cases by Putin to let him take Ukraine.
But, with Trump, it's of note of how odd he's acting. He talks to Putin more than he talks to Zelensky. Optimism would wish that this is merely a case of keeping one's friends close and one's enemies closer.
but I think it's pretty clear to me that there is little material or personal interest for Trump to defend Ukraine. Ideologically he's far more aligned with Putin and his economic class in Russia than anything in Ukraine.
I don't think Trump wakes up and says 'Glory to the Russian Federation, death to holhols', frankly I don't even think he cares that much. But I believe his interests align with Putin.