Ruzu @carlosruzu@gameliberty.club

@FallenFadedLostItAll@freak.university @Aldo2 @applejack >Put together, i see society reaching a point where sexuality and everything is "normal", teens are aware and accepting of all the important things and nobody cares if youre straight or queer or asexual or whatever; where sexist biases are gone so nobody even argues over gender identity and your sex is a medical thing, not constraint upon your lifestyle.

seems cool, although idk people always talk about discrimination in general like its something to destroy. I'm black so I'm biased but just like racism, you're always going to have a society that has some jackass if not a community of them that entertain sexist shit. I think a more concrete goal is to reach a point in society where its relatively easy to talk with people about sexuality.
With that in mind, with your "nobody even argues over gender identity", if you''re refering to people just accepting identities, I don't think thats the most healthy as its just an echo chamber for your sexuality and doesnt aid with sexual maturity. Just try and make a society where people can be respectful to one another, regardless of their opinions and identities on sexualities and whatnot. Just because you personally wouldn't have the same opinion on sexuality as someone else doesn't mean that you can't speak to them or whatever. Think of it like this, a christian can still respect a homosexual and essentially treat them like a good Samirtian, accepting they don't have the same beliefs as them. If we had a society like that, I think that would be good

>Age of consent wont be an issue if all you do is determine whether or not there was or was not confirmed consent, dealing with incidents situationally.
Only caveat: let me add that there should be a legal option for parents to choose if they want to restrict their children from such shit, as again all this shit would be controversial especially to the Matt Walsh's of the world and even you said that the parent should have the say on their child's relationship. To make sure this doesn't go overboard, perhaps make an inverse AoC in that at a certain age, your parents can't restrict you romantically or sexually and you're personally responsible for your shit. That way, if parents aren't fine with their children going that far yet, they can still give the final say whilst if they are fine with it, and the child in puberty is fine with it, thats on them. This would be my big concern and very mandatory from my end for this to work

@FallenFadedLostItAll@freak.university @Aldo2 @applejack the idea that age in of itself is the only reason why kids cannot consent is a flawed one admitedly, but its one greater society will continue to perpetuate because most people don't even want to address any situation with any difference in age within relationships, as seen with the CallMeCarson situation, more or less actually talk about how we should approach consent with children going through puberty. Tbf the possibility of the latter happening is marred by pedo copers having no actualy solution to prevent child rape but I digress. Needless to say, I'm glad you value individuality

@Aldo2 @applejack @FallenFadedLostItAll@freak.university i thought this bitch was really gonna say "parenting is bad"

@FallenFadedLostItAll@freak.university @Aldo2 @applejack >For children, the default authority to judge whether a relationship or activity is too risky falls to the parents to judge, whether thats sex or hrt or learning to cook. In all cases, that responsibility is ultimately passed over to the child, after theyve been educated enough to make those decisions for themselves.

I guess thats fair. Undoing legislation of morality is usually good and this still provides a reasonable bar against child rape, plus its an individualistic approach. IDK If I agree with this but I certainly respect a lot more than the other person, Miria, pedo coping and being like "All Sex is OK as long as people enjoy it, thus consent is useless"

>Sexual maturity is finalized by puberty; thus, all the requisite education to be able to make decisions of informed consent involving sex should also be finalized by the onset or during the height of puberty.

Very much disagree with this completely. Sexual maturity is an ongoing process. Its not "finalized" and it'll never be finalized. People casually spend their entire lifetime exploring themselves and whatnot, so i reject this idea
That said, by the end of puberty, you should know how informed consent works.

>It is also my opinion that gender choices and preferences are something they should explore during puberty, and if we tossed out sexism there wouldnt be an issue with choosing genders in the first place. The vast majority of gender confusion and stress is a result of the environment; we like and dislike certain things, yet society and fashion tell us "this is for boys, that is for girls, you have to conform to one or the other in everything you do", which us harmful. I believe a better, accepting culture would render most of the gender arguments moot, leaving only a few exceptional cases where someone genuinely takes issue with their biological organs.

Ehhhhh. I'd like to add that especially with people with dysphoria, gender confusion is something internal. It can and usually is worsened by the world around us but its def something internal. Some people, myself, are comfortable in their gender regardless of feminine or masculine traits, Some of the manliest men or femine women, however, will still struggle with things like "Am I manly/womanly" enough. Society does worsen this confusion though. Homie of mine is bi but thought he was trans when he was a teen because he liked dresses and instead of being told that even though thats feminine in the West, thats fine, he got told he was experiencing gender dysphoria. Anyways best way to avoid this is just think about which gender/sexuality you're fine with. You don't have to spend too much thought on it, just go with what feels right with you. From there, stick with a community that has people that respect your identity and along with that, people who respectfully question it. When I told my homie that I'm ace, he said that I may be having a bruh moment and might just be retarded. Ironically enough, instead of discouraging me from being ace, it just made me reaffirm my aceness more, to which he actually respected. Nowadays we causally talk about our shits with sexuality and whatnot like idk once every 3-4 months. You ofc don't want everyone in your group to question you constantly but imo having people that actually inquired me about my sexuality helped me figure it out more, kinda like trying jigsaw puzzle pieces and trying to find what goes where

>These cases should be dealt with carefully, and things like hrt and body modification surgeries should be postponed until post-puberty so they can be absolutely sure of the decision, the potential consequences, and avoid the risks associated with doing those things while the body is still changing during puberty. At least for now; we still dont fully have a grasp on how hormones and organs all work and what effects they have at each stage of human growth.

holy shit, based??!?!?!?!??!? especially considering all that talk about gender introspection, I was worried you're an SJW. Tbf you have an explicit pfp but still, cool to meet a queer person that actually thinks for themselves

@FallenFadedLostItAll@freak.university @Aldo2 @applejack customers especially. some of them are just actual creatures. sometime sgoing in there feels like a instance of playing skyrim with how many npc convos you'll get into

@FallenFadedLostItAll@freak.university @Aldo2 @applejack >How do you know when a kid can make his own bowl of cereal for breakfast?

while you're waiting for them to be old enough to do that, you can choose to bring them around you and show them how you make a bowl of cereal. Once they are for sure old enough to actually be able to make their own breakfast, you help them out the first few times with making breakfast before allowing them to go on there own. Most of this can probs apply to sexuality, ofc most of it relying on verbal communication and not just, well, acutally doing it because I hope we can at least agree that incest is unhealthy.

>You can ascertain their comprehension well enough by having them explain thinfs back to you, same as every other subject they study in school. At what point, exactly, do you know that a child can perform addition and multiplication? AFTER theyve been taught, theyve practiced, and they are able to infer new results aside from rote memorization.

Yeah we could benefit from better convos from parent to child about sexual education and what not. Even then, you can't really just simply expect explaining something thats as subjective and explorative as sexuality to be able to be explained as easily as math. You want to be able to give that child some choice and as such, you want to wait until they've developed a bit of an identity and started being comfortable with their body during puberty, whenever that is, before you have those convos.

>Once you educate and start treating kids as responsible adults - giving them the freedom to make their choices and holding them accountable to consequences, and actually respecting them for the sentient beings they are - they mature real quickly, and tend to grow up more mentally and emotionally stable (and not so dumb in terms of decision making).

You're boiling down relationship compatibility, sexuality exploration, etc. into "we can educate people on this and they will be able to quickly get into this" sure the basics like informed consent and what not are good for explanation but you won't be able to cover everything and shouldn't go in with that explanation. Also like you said, people mature differently. Some go fast, as people fucking in high school can show, but some are slow, I myself am a very reserved person. The point of a convo on sexual education from parent to child is to explain the basics to set them up to explore them on their own, with the age of consent being there as a guideline for when this process should be done.

>Forget the obsession for defining things by a "when" or age. Thats arbitrary, derived, and completely inaccurate considering the fact that everyone develops, physically, mentally, and emotionally, at different rates. Instead of insisting on a broken bubble to wrap around inaccurate categorizations, fucking judge instances situationally.

Its literally impossible for the government to go through every adult child relationship and try to determine "hmmmm is the child able to consent for this scenario". The point of the AoC isn't "this is when everyone can consent"; its "by this age, people should know how to consent"

>If an incident occurs, it and one party was not able to clearly consent or be able to explain in court what they were consenting to and the likely consequences, then obviously theres a problem and probably a crime to deal with, bc now you have a victim.
If the kid can tell a judge or other official, counselor, whatever, that they willingly indulged in sexual activities with a particular person, and that they were aware of consequences and fully cognizant at the time the decision to consent was made, then there probably isnt a crime.

It's easy to lie about this however, especially considering that namely people around the age of 12 can be easily manipulated by people above 18, namely late 20 year olds, especially considering that during puberty you are experience random influxes of hormones that really add onto why a child may not want to seem like they were co erced into the act. Even you yourself show that you aren't completely sure on how we would handle this with words like "propably", which is just not really applicable for the law as laws in society have to be a set standard.

>This isn't half as difficult or complicated as everyone wants it to be. It only gets muddled up because youve got all these biases and social stigmas and bs laws in place disambiguating what is actually a problem and what is not.

its muddied up because the whole spectrum of sexualities that can anyone can fall into depending on their sexual urge (which itself can vary based on homosexuality vs heterosexuality, comfortability with other sexualities, comfortability with genetelia, etc) and consent.
Along with that, just because a law doesn't directly address a specific issue doesn't mean it doesn't help in other ways. AoC again doesn't directly prevent abuse as we see, but it does give a guideline as to when we can reasonably expect everyone to be able to consent. Just because some people at 14/13/whatever are able to conceive of when to have sex, doesn't mean we should adjust laws to accomodate them, when they can wait until they are 16 /18 to actually go out and have relations with adults, meanwhile exploring themselves on their own/with their family

@Aldo2 @applejack @FallenFadedLostItAll@freak.university they're joking?

@Charfuhrer @FallenFadedLostItAll@freak.university @Aldo2 @applejack i didnt even tag you, whats the point of you saying that?

@Aldo2 @FallenFadedLostItAll@freak.university @applejack Supermarkets can be pretty uncanny at times. So big, its no wonder people get lost in things like Walmart

@FallenFadedLostItAll@freak.university @Aldo2 @applejack also this topic is literally depressing. first convo here and we go from a chill light hearted convo on lolis straight into "why being anti pedo is unjustifiable". its no wonder anyone would talk about literally anything else

@FallenFadedLostItAll@freak.university @Aldo2 @applejack agaiin, how do you tell when a child can and cannot consent, realistically we don't have anyway atm to know when they have the mental capacity to consent. Being anti pedo isnt a social take as rape is objectively evil and the whole point of being anti pedo is to prevent any case of rape that could happen due to pedophilia, if you are of the idea that the two are seperate in the first place

@applejack @Aldo2 @FallenFadedLostItAll@freak.university and those boys will still get shit on by grown men

@Aldo2 @FallenFadedLostItAll@freak.university @applejack first off, second, at that point, the argument used against women being in the military would kick in for sub 15s as their bone structure is literally underdeveloped compared to grown men. In short, if they fought the army of a developed country, they'd literally be fucked in a soldier vs soldier standpoint

@Aldo2 @FallenFadedLostItAll@freak.university @applejack yeah I agree that if you're able to go to war, youre able to have sex. You wouldn't send sub 15s to war though

@Aldo2 @FallenFadedLostItAll@freak.university @applejack

@FallenFadedLostItAll@freak.university @applejack @Aldo2 also aoc isn't the reason we have shit sex ed

@FallenFadedLostItAll@freak.university @applejack @Aldo2 that's the thing, people assume the age of consent is a thing of "difference of age is bad" when it's more along the lines of "we don't know exactly when someone is fully capable to consent so let's set a standard in age so that it gives people time to develop as a person in that regard before they approach that" The main red flag with adult child relations is none of this gender exploration, it's always down to a matter of "are they in the proper state to consent". I'll read the rest of that earlier post to see if you addressed this but it's like what I said earlier, we can't tell if a drunk person is able to consent so we just wait until they are sober. If we had a way to know they are fully capable to consent, that'd be fine but until then it's best to wait