@Chizu Actually your boss takes more than the government
I'm still anti-tax, but worth to remember

@Spaghettimon @Chizu
Employer: "I will give you 10$ if do X for me"
Employee: "I agree"
Troglodytes: "Theft!"

@matrix @Spaghettimon Rephrase:
Employer: "I'll give you $10 if you do this for me"
Employee: "Fine"
Employer: "Thanks, I made $5000 from the work you did for me, he's a piece of cake as a reward and your $10 payment"

@Chizu @Spaghettimon If you think that your labor is worth $5000, sell it for $5000 on your own

@matrix @Chizu You say that like the power balance is balanced between employer and employee, when it isn't. I current society, your life is hostage to the system. If you try to sell your work for what it is indeed worth and the owners of the means decline because they wouldn't have a profit, you'd starve. In this way, your very life is hostage that you accept their deal and not that they accept yours

@Spaghettimon @Chizu There isn't a single owner of muh means of production so you can sell it to a different one for what you think it's worth. If your labor is truly worth that much, the first guy that refused to pay well will loose money for not employing you.

@matrix @Spaghettimon Have you ever heard of price fixing?

@Chizu @Spaghettimon Yes, it's illegal and also gives incentive for new players to enter the market and undercut the fixed price

@matrix @Spaghettimon Except that labour has been price fixed for a long long time, just without an official agreement. The companies that don't price fix labour are few and high in demand so have no openings.

Fixed minimum wage is also really a form of price fixing, especially when it does not raise by inflation.

@Chizu @Spaghettimon Ah yes, every year the men with top hats and monocles get together in a smoke filled room and discuss at what price to fix labor at.

Are you making an argument against minimum wage?

@matrix @Spaghettimon Minimum wage should climb with inflation, as it is now in many places it does not.

@Chizu @Spaghettimon I agree with you here. It should either go up with inflation or not exist at all.

@matrix @Spaghettimon and that means it should catch up too, in the usa if it had kept up in the past it would be $30+ now

@Chizu @Spaghettimon I guess I forgot the specifics about US minimum wage. It can't be federal though since the US so big and diverse.

@matrix @Spaghettimon there is a federal minimum wage, ironically some states have a lower minimum wage than it but the federal one overrides it.
The federal one should be the baseline and it should creep up with inflation, and be caught up with where it should be, then the states can decide how much more they want it to be there.

@Chizu
No. Minimum wage needs to reflect the local economy, so the most the federal government should do is "If you don't set federal wage, you'll follow ours". It would be like trying to argue that Germany and Slovakia should have the same minimum wage,
From what I know it isn't unreasonable to ask for $30 to cover living expenses, but it is in Texas or Florida.
@Spaghettimon

@matrix @Chizu Employers will always pay the minimum they can, look at Elon and Nestlé employing literal slave labour

@Spaghettimon @matrix @Chizu ur a communist tho so you think slave labour is pretty based no?

@Mysha @matrix @Chizu No, to the opposite. We see slavery as being worse than current capitalism, and current capitalism as a variant of slavery

@Spaghettimon @matrix @Chizu i was joking partially

forced labor seems to be a favorite of alot of tankies and honestly is the "morally correct" equivalent to slave labor

also i just noticed ive been spelling labor like a brit 🤮

@Mysha @matrix @Chizu Communism throws away the idea of morality as it has no base in facts, going for ethics instead

The idea of communism (marxism here to be more precise) is that paying for time makes no sense, since the quality and the quantity of work made during a given amount of time may greatly vary from person to person and does not take the end result into consideration

So the paying (in which in a truly marxist community would be without money) would be based on your results. Besides that, by Marx, work ought to be a right, not a duty. One works if they want, with what they want and the only way for something to truly be a right is if it is not a need. That is, if you need to work to survive, society has turned it into a duty in which you're obligated to do something you don't want for a society you didn't ask to be a part of