@beardalaxy @matrix japanese slow scripting language was designed to be fun

@beardalaxy @matrix Never tried it, but it's probably better than the JS cancer they are using now.

@xianc78 @matrix I'm honestly not sure. People have made crazier things with js but that might just be down to popularity.

@beardalaxy @matrix The problem with JS is that it probably uses something like Electron to turn it into a desktop application, which means that it's just basically bundling Chromium with a bunch of HTML and JS files into an executable file. Your program is basically dependent on Google and even though Chromium and Blink are open-source, I don't know a single viable fork of it and I highly doubt that RPG Maker is using that.

It's also my main beef with C# right now because Microsoft basically has full control over both implementations of the language (.NET and Mono). I don't really care about the practical side of things because I know that lower-level languages are hard, but there are some ethical concerns with languages that are controlled by the likes of Microsoft or Google.

@xianc78 @matrix there are ethical concerns with basically everything

@xianc78 @matrix plus, I mean, I'm using rpg maker. It's not foss in the first place lol.

@beardalaxy @matrix I know it's not FOSS, but people have tried to make FOSS compilers for proprietary engines. I know GameMaker has (or used to have) a FOSS compiler known as ENIGMA. But GameMaker software is cross-compiled to Delphi (or at least it used to). If someone were to make a libre compiler for RPG Maker they might have to also use Google's JS engine unless someone creates a better alternative.

@xianc78 @matrix little off topic but there's actually a foss replacement for rpg maker 2000/2003 called easy rpg that you can plug your game into. It's pretty sweet.

@xianc78 @beardalaxy @matrix A big plus with open source is that we can fork if we need to. Forking comes with a lot of challenges, but the option is a big plus over proprietary systems.

@Rocket @beardalaxy @matrix The problem is that modern web browsers are very complex and contain multiple components (rendering engine, JS engine, etc). Even popular browser forks like Brave and LibreWolf only fork the front-ends and are still dependent on unmodified back-ends. The only browser fork I know of that is completely independent is PaleMoon which forked Mozilla's old rendering engine.

@xianc78 @Rocket @beardalaxy There's also Ladybird, but it's years away from being usable. Their js library is the most upto spec implementation though.

@xianc78 @beardalaxy @matrix You’re conflating JS/WA engines like v8 and SpiderMonkey, generic runtime engines with multiple applications using them, with Chromium. Electron existing is in no way a fault with JS

I don’t know a single viable fork

Well, they are the forks. Apple forked KHTML, then Google forked WebKit

@RedTechEngineer @j @matrix That is accurate. (Might also be faster at this point.)

@RedTechEngineer @j @matrix Rails is slower than Java.

@p @RedTechEngineer @matrix @j java is fast

@feld @sun @RedTechEngineer @j @matrix It's got a lot of boilerplate required, that it requires both compile step and to be launched by a JVM, and that it was controlled by Oracle. I think those are still valid complaints. I never liked auto-boxing as a fix for the other thing I never liked, ints (etc.) not being real objects, but the way that works might not apply any more.

But like the compilation plus JVM deal, it reeks of this half-measure thinking that kind of pervades committee-designed enterprise languages, it's a stultifying environment designed to comfort managers rather than a language designed for hackers to express algorithms. I'm old so I get that sort of thing has a place (even if I'd rather have an M21, the infantry has to have rifles too and they are better served by an M16 than an M21), but it's a language, and I don't like the shape my thoughts come out in. Dick Gabriel's "debate with a compiler" remark, you know?

@sun @RedTechEngineer @j @matrix When did that happen?

@j @matrix I actually picked it initially because gcc and Perl didn't fit on my iPAQ, which only had 32MB of storage. So the options were Python or Ruby (both of them could be installed in only a few megs back then) and I picked Ruby because I hated the concept of syntactically significant whitespace.

@RedTechEngineer @j @matrix Even if Fabrice Bellard had done it by then, 32-bit ARM was still a niche platform.

@RedTechEngineer @j @matrix He must be from the same part of France that lanodan is from, they must be making them somewhere.

@p @matrix

@j @p @matrix RETVRN

@noyoushutthefuckupdad @j @matrix I already did.
IMG_8954.jpg

@RedTechEngineer @j @matrix @noyoushutthefuckupdad Chips are made of rocks.

@j @matrix Is that one a Phone? I had one of the Compaq ones, the first version, no wifi.

@mario @matrix You forgot compiling that stuff.

Most time goes by compiling. And compiling again. And wondering why your compiler cache system is failing this time again.